Re: Charismatics, healings, tongues! What a bunch of... ?
Just to set the record straight. I am a tongue talking, spirit filled, bible thumpin' Born again Christian. It seems to me that all of you might need some inspiration from the Holy Spirit and not so much theology. 2 Tim 3:16 Try some inspiration for yourselves. Sit down with the bible and start praying in tongues and meditate on the word of God and watch it come alive.
Re: Charismatics, healings, tongues! What a bunch of... ?
I don't see anyone saying anything derogatory about talking in tongues, second nice of you to judge another... and last but not least, the word talks time and time again to study the word, to approve all things by that word... and you wish to come here and tell us to listen to something other then that doctrine? Its nice that you talk in tongues... if its not that gibberish tongue talking jive some do for show, then again, the word is clear, that other things are more important... love, charity, standinf fast to the faith instilled by the Spirit... so i ask you... did Jesus talk in tongues? Did Paul prefer tongues... or other gifts?
avseven Registered User
Posts: 1
(1/2/03 10:41 am) Reply
Re: Charismatics, healings, tongues! What a bunch of... ?
Hi there. Just found the board.
Those who insist that the healings phase never ended: have you bothered to compare today's "healers" to those of the book of Acts? Go ahead. Taste and see...
Prove all things...
Try the spirits...
Peter and Paul were able to heal, and even raise the dead. But the big difference between the apostles hand picked by Jesus, and these modern "apostles" is this: in the book of Acts, nobody fails in an attempt to get somebody healed, or raised from the dead. They batted 1000. in "healings".
Since the "healings" phase never ended, we should see the same results. So, just start carting out all of today's charismatics who have healed everybody that showed up at the "healing service".
Friend, I have seen these guys on television, at their healing services. Only certain people ever get "healed", and I wonder about those cases, since I personally know of men who were hired as part of charismatic scams, to set up fake healing sessions. Their first hand testimony, not my second hand.
So, where are the healers, that healed everybody who showed up, to be healed...?
Passed?
KJV James 5:14 Is any sick among you? let him call for the elders of the church; and let them pray over him, anointing him with oil in the name of the Lord:
James 5:15 And the prayer of faith shall save the sick, and the Lord shall raise him up; and if he have committed sins, they shall be forgiven him.
KJV Mark 10:52 And Jesus said unto him, Go thy way; thy faith hath made thee whole. And immediately he received his sight, and followed Jesus in the way.
KJV Mathew 9:22 But Jesus turned him about, and when he saw her, he said, Daughter, be of good comfort; thy faith hath made thee whole. And the woman was made whole from that hour.
SaintedOne
Unregistered User
(1/8/03 2:33 pm) Reply
Spiritual Gifts
In order to have Spiritual Gifts, You must be a Good christian, which leaves out 99.9% of all christians today who put God last in their life. God picks only People that have passed his little test that he throws at all christians. Pray and Fast and God will show himself to you like never before. Also, you must stop sinning. Once you do that God will be with you.
avseven Registered User
Posts: 4
(1/8/03 6:35 pm) Reply
Re: Spiritual Gifts
Quote:
In order to have Spiritual Gifts, You must be a Good christian, which leaves out 99.9% of all christians today who put God last in their life. God picks only People that have passed his little test that he throws at all christians. Pray and Fast and God will show himself to you like never before. Also, you must stop sinning. Once you do that God will be with you.
If you want spiritual Gifts....You ask for them. worship.nu/spiritual-warfare/ The answers to Your Problems.
I challenged our charismatics to explain why no charismatic "bishop", or "apostle", or "prophetic", or otherwise "gifted" christian, can produce the consistent results of a Peter, or Paul. It was a simple challenge. A plain challenge. I didn't use big words.
Yet, the two responses that came afterward reveal to us that charismatics don't obligate themselves to listen, or think. They just floated up some fluffy marshmallows, that made them feel good...
We never said we wanted any "spiritual gifts", did we? We are happy with what we have: our sanity. We can discuss things, on the "bible discussion boards". You cannot. Nor can you produce the results of Peter and Paul, despite Jesus being the same yesterday, today, and forever, etc.
Your spiritual gifts are make believe. They're imaginary. But, you just go right ahead living your fantasy. If that is what gets you through the night, I am so happy for you.
I have a bible. I read it. I believe it. That is the greatest spiritual gift on earth. Truth. Prophetic truth.
You'd know that, if you actually payed attention to what God has to say, in his book. Enjoy your fantasy...
Those verses I showed you are just a few verses that show that healing is indeed possible, through prayer, fasting and anointing in the name of Christ our Lord.
Jesus said if we have faith as small as a mustard seed we can move a mountain. . . if my faith is less then a mustard seed, and I cannot move that mountain, or move God to heal my brother through the faith I have in God, then I have to understand that, and live with the fact that some men found more favor with God, and He chose to use them as His vessel of healing.
I can live with that. Healing is possible. Now some, like this Hollywood, floor falling, head smacking fad is clearly out for the money. . . none the less, if you believe that since Paul died, God has not healed one person, then I think you have lost sight of the mercies of God.
Just my take, hope your not offened.
KingJehu
avseven Registered User
Posts: 5
(1/9/03 9:03 am) Reply
Re: Healing
Quote:
none the less, if you believe that since Paul died, God has not healed one person, then I think you have lost sight of the mercies of God.
Did I say I believe that? Did I even imply that? What sane man would accuse me of saying that, based on my posts in this thread?
Every time we are sick, and don't die, God was in it, whether he used a doctor, a medicine, or the body's own built-in immune system. If you think I said "God has not healed one person since Paul died", you are badly in need of help.
I asked you charismatics to produce the results of Peter and Paul: perfect results. Since you didn't produce those results, I want to know why you can't. Jesus Christ the same yesterday, today, and forever.
This makes the third time I have asked this simple question, and all I get from you is side stepping. You're dishonest. You can't deal with the question, O king.
Don't falsely accuse me of saying what I didn't say. Look at what I did say. Answer the question...!
Nice judgement call. . . avseven
FIRST off I am in no way a charismatic, NICE of you to judge me though. . . second what leads me to believe you feel we cannot be healed by the spirit of God, is this.
Quote:
Your spiritual gifts are make believe. They're imaginary. But, you just go right ahead living your fantasy. If that is what gets you through the night, I am so happy for you.
Third I never onced claimed to have been a vessel of God to heal others at all. Not once. You go on.
Quote:
This makes the third time I have asked this simple question, and all I get from you is side stepping. You're dishonest. You can't deal with the question, O king.
I did to answer it. . . I said my faith is not as much as it should be, in the belief that all things are possible with God. It is my lack of faith in God, that keeps God from using me as a vessel of healing. I can admit that, you can't.
Mark 6:5 And he could there do no mighty work, save that he laid his hands upon a few sick folk, and healed them.
Mark 6:6 And he marvelled because of their unbelief. And he went round about the villages, teaching.
Mathew 17:20 And Jesus said unto them, Because of your unbelief: for verily I say unto you, If ye have faith as a grain of mustard seed, ye shall say unto this mountain, Remove hence to yonder place; and it shall remove; and nothing shall be impossible unto you.
THAT is why you and I cannot heal, that or God has gifted us in other areas. . . one of the two.
1 Corinitains 12:4 Now there are diversities of gifts, but the same Spirit.
5 And there are differences of administrations, but the same Lord.
6 And there are diversities of operations, but it is the same God which worketh all in all.
7 But the manifestation of the Spirit is given to every man to profit withal.
8 For to one is given by the Spirit the word of wisdom; to another the word of knowledge by the same Spirit;
9 To another faith by the same Spirit; to another the gifts of healing by the same Spirit;
10 To another the working of miracles; to another prophecy; to another discerning of spirits; to another divers kinds of tongues; to another the interpretation of tongues:
11 But all these worketh that one and the selfsame Spirit, dividing to every man severally as he will.
12 For as the body is one, and hath many members, and all the members of that one body, being many, are one body: so also is Christ.
Now you can believe the bible or not, you can believe those words or deny them, you can even twist them to your liking. . . theres alot of that going on these days, but to any bible based Christain, those words are clear and to all Christian. You can't pick and chose what verses you want to believe and which ones not to.
James 5:13 Is any among you afflicted? let him pray. Is any merry? let him sing psalms.
James 5:14 Is any sick among you? let him call for the elders of the church; and let them pray over him, anointing him with oil in the name of the Lord:
James 5:15 And the prayer of faith shall save the sick, and the Lord shall raise him up; and if he have committed sins, they shall be forgiven him.
James 5:16 Confess your faults one to another, and pray one for another, that ye may be healed. The effectual fervent prayer of a righteous man availeth much.
Why can't I heal, because I am not as righteous a man "faithful" as I should be. I lack faith in the ability of God to heal someone infront of my eyes.
Also we get back to the faith deal again. We walk by faith not by sight. If we all went around healing the lame, we would believe in God because of the healings and not of faith. Same with the non believers. If they had concrete proof God was using people to heal others, they would turn to Father because of things they saw and not because of faith.
I am sorry you have felt the need to be rude to me in your last post. I didnt mean for anything I said to be taken as offencive as you will see in my post, the last words. Nor did I say you believed God has never healed anyone since Pauls time, I said if you do, then you have missed out on the message of God. It seems you dont believe that. . . and on that we agree.
Blessings
KingJehu.
avseven Registered User
Posts: 7
(1/12/03 4:02 pm) Reply
Re: Nice judgement call. . . avseven
Dude, you do not make any sense. You cannot deal with the question. You're bizarre.
Jesus, in the passage you printed, healed people, despite their "unbelief". Unbelief has nothing to do with it.
On the one hand, you believe in "tongues and healing", and then when you fail to pull it off, you claim you do not believe "strongly enough". That is very phony. And I can't deal with it.
I only talk to honest people. I am not patient enough to deal with silly children. Merry Christmas. Happy New Year.
Jesus, in the passage you printed, healed people, despite their "unbelief". Unbelief has nothing to do with it.
Your wrong about this one too, they are asking Christ, why they couldn't vex a evil spirit from a man, but Christ could, and Christ replied. . .
Mathew 17:20 And Jesus said unto them, Because of your unbelief: for verily I say unto you, If ye have faith as a grain of mustard seed, ye shall say unto this mountain, Remove hence to yonder place; and it shall remove; and nothing shall be impossible unto you.
And Jesus said unto them, Because of your unbelief: <<< very clear as all can see. Second I note that thats the only one you address. . . so i assume you agree with the rest, and concede.
Also no need to insult brother. . . I'm just a man of Christ seeking other views. . . Yes I believe in tongues and other gifts, but as I have shown God grants things by measure of our faith. . .
Mathew 9:28 And when he was come into the house, the blind men came to him: and Jesus saith unto them, Believe ye that I am able to do this? They said unto him, Yea, Lord.
Mathew 9:29 Then touched he their eyes, saying, According to your faith be it unto you.
again and different verses there then in the first post. . .
KJV Luke 7:50 And he said to the woman, Thy faith hath saved thee; go in peace.
KJV Luke 18:42 And Jesus said unto him, Receive thy sight: thy faith hath saved thee.
now in the other forum about JW's I asked where they all went you psoted, why should they mess with someone like you that knows the word, there are others would they can fool, but not those that know the word or something to that effect. . . I say this not to toot my own horn, but to point out in the same day you said I new the word and then turned right around and said i was dishonest and childish. . . I am not saying this to usurp you or naything, or be hindminded. . . nor do I profess I know everything or even alot about the word, but I believe If we have a constructive debate, you will see my points are valid as them post and many more show. . . also we have a chat room on the undernet and dalnet when its up. . . #christianwarrior . . . if you hvae irc and would like to debate there, please feel free to join us, and I hope I havent offened you again. . .
Our chat room url and a link to my beliefs and many others.
avseven Registered User
Posts: 8
(1/14/03 5:01 pm) Reply
Re: Nice judgement call. . . avseven"And he said unto them, Go ye into all the world, and preach the gospel to every creature.
He that believeth and is baptized shall be saved; but he that believeth not shall be damned.
And these signs shall follow them that believe; In my name shall they cast out devils; they shall speak with new tongues;
They shall take up serpents; and if they drink any deadly thing, it shall not hurt them; they shall lay hands on the sick, and they shall recover." (Mark 16:16-18 )
You'd better look at Mark 16 again, bud.
"And these signs shall follow them that believe..."
What's the problem, charismatic? Don't you believe?
Aren't charismatics hilarious? They're always blabbering about their "gifts", but when you ask them why they can't drink poison, or handle serpents, or heal the sick, or raise the dead, like Peter and Paul did, then they want to run and hide behind some verse that proves the apostles really didn't have the "gifts" either.
The apostles didn't get the "signs" until Mark 16:17. When they got them, you don't see any more failed attempts, on their part. Do you? Well...? See any apostles, after the resurrection of Christ, complaining about not being able to exercise his "gift", because he lacked the "faith"?
Somebody doesn't know his way around his bible, does he? You got yourself all fouled up, in the book, when all you had to do was start on page one, and just read, and pray, and believe.
You know what your problem is? Lack of a bible education. You think you know the book. You don't lack "faith". You just don't know what you're talking about. Tee hee.
Sainted One
Unregistered User
(1/21/03 4:13 am) Reply
avseven
If you was charismatic on dal in #christiandebate or #christian you was a-kicked. That is where Kingjedu is on his walk...hating Gods people that are above him spirituality. How sad. King charismatic people are people that God sees as good enuf to use for miracles. none of the ops (including you) are in that catagory. people like you and your fellow ops will never be used by God...but you are used by satan very much....you have to ask yourself...do you want to work for God or satan!!
By the way, your room on dal was taken form you from God.
KingJehu
Unregistered User
(8/18/03 12:31 am) Reply
Errrrrr
Didn't see this here.
Number one, show any hate at all?
Second, #ChristianWarrior and #ChristianDebate have not been taken from anyone, so it seems, that God still wants us there
Also nice of this guy to slander, without proof to back it up, if these event took place, then logs that can be checked by the bots would prove it, simple as that.
Spiritual Gifts
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